Synopsis
With her knack for being in trouble’s way, Sookie witnesses the firebombing of Merlotte’s, the bar where she works. Since Sam Merlotte is now known to be two-natured, suspicion falls immediately on the anti-shifters in the area. But Sookie suspects otherwise and she and Sam work together to uncover the culprit – and the twisted motive for the attack. But her attention is divided. Though she can’t ‘read’ vampires, Sookie knows her lover Eric Northman and his ‘child’ Pam well – and she realises that they are plotting to kill the vampire who is now their master. Gradually, she is drawn into the plot -which is much more complicated than she knows. Caught up in the politics of the vampire world, Sookie will learn that she is as much of a pawn as any ordinary human – and that there is a new Queen on the board . . . (H/T Sookieverse)
Speculation
Texas Take ‘Em – A Lesson in Vampire Politics by Serena
A Lesson in Vampire Politics, Part II by Serena
Charlaine Harris revealed Lisa Desimini’s cover for Dead Reckoning today.
We will be reading chapter one in a few short weeks. I can’t wait. On another note: I just read over at facebook that CH pushed back the companion book until fall. Fall? So we won’t know what happened at the Dallas Wedding until then?
That’s strange. I guess her timeline is out of sequence now, too, like TB’s. LOL!
My instant reaction to the first glimpse of the new cover is..OH-OH.
A sinking feeling that all is not going to go well for Sookie.
That said, Osterby is so right. We’ll be reading the first chapter soon and parsing every word and punctuation mark. Can’t wait.
Wow guys, I hope the BL’s don’t get their way with this one.
Based on the synopsis, I’m telling myself that her relationship with Eric is coasting along in this book, which seems to focus on vampire politics and those damned letters, which have turned her world upside down.
I think the political fallout might bode ill for the happy couple in #12 though.
Yesh, I figure their relationship might hit a bumpy patch before the end but BL’s are salivating that CH is going to reveal something very bad about Eric. I haven’t checked yet but I know they’re saying the cover means she’s turned upside down because of something she found out about Eric.
Serena did a bang up job figuring out how the politcal wind is blowing and what that will mean to E/S (links above). If she’s right, Eric is going to need to enter into a politcal marriage with the queen of Oklahoma, setting up a parallel to the SA-Theadgill-Hadley triangle. I look for that to be the focus of book 12, though.
Oh Pffft. The BL’s live on their own Planet Weird/D’Nile. They couldn’t accept the reveal in TB at the end of the season. It’s like those women that marry guys in jail for life. Not a mindset I can relate to.
It’s frightening and sad. “He didn’t know/love her then!” Who gives a f*ck? Why does that even matter? He still deliberately caused grievous harm to a stranger. Is that the kind of person you would want Sookie/yourself/your daughter/sister/friend to be with? If he were real he would be in prison for what he did and deservedly so. But yeah, they don’t give a shit about Sookie, it’s all about Bill and what he wants.
ic is going to need to enter into a politcal marriage
Oi vey, is that ever going to cause some angst!
*ic is Eric, of course.
The sound you hear is the wailing and gnashing of teeth. Angst is an understatement.
I will be wailing and gnashing my teeth over the smirks of the BL’s if/when that happens. I can’t stand it when shit goes their way.
When CH/AB do stuff like that it feels like they take sadistic pleasure in comforting the comfortable and afflicting the afflicted.
We’re certainly not set up for a B/S reconciliation. In DITF Bill was a total douche asking for sex with Sookie to help him heal, and then CH made a sister/lover to pair him off with. He was more sympathetic in previous books, and this was the first one where Sookie admitted to herself that she should have walked away form Bill much sooner than she did.
I dont’ see anything happening with Bill beyond a shoulder to cry on, if that. It’s not even like she can go to him for info because Eric is the one who gives her more info about vampire shit than Bill.
For the past week I’ve been engaged in a battle royal over at you know where.
“Of course Bill is a serial killing sociopath. All vampires are. You can’t blame him for what he did before he fell in love. Eric would have done the exact same thing.
Whoooohooo! Up with the VRA, and down with those evil bastards at FOTS!”
WTF???
WTF indeed. If they’re all serial killing sociopath’s why aren’t they on the side of the FoTS???
I effing HATE it when they try to equate all vampires with Bill. Like that makes him any better. 80
Question: How can you stand it over at you know where? I’ve been reading the last couple of days and I can tell you now, I’d go ballistic on “IamtruetoBill”‘s ass and get banned. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised that BL’s are free to spew trash but EL’s–except you– are afraid to strongly defend Eric.
What can I say? When SVB settled down, I went looking for trouble. LOL!
I’ve dealt with the cat and now I’m waiting for Iamtrue to return and realize that instead of shutting me down, she had the opposite effect. My appetite for conflict has been satisfied though. I’ve said all I have to say. Besides, I’ve been wasting too much time and emotional energy over there instead of writing new material.
I don’t think they believe there will be a reconciliation with Bill. They believe that Eric will be dragged down to Bill’s level or revealed as evil. I think they’re perfectly fine with Sookie ending up with Sam, as long as she doesn’t end up with Eric.
I don’t care what they think. The final book will be unequivocal and set the record straight.
Think I’ll just keep my head down & wait it out. Last time CH put the first chapter on line before the book was published.
Charlaine post on her Official Fan Site :”For everyone waiting for the first chapter of DEAD RECKONING to be posted on my website: it’s being formatted right now and will probably be up some time tomorrow. Merry Christmas!”
CH posted this yesterday.
Thanks Osterby. I was about to go and check the site.
Tick-tock…
I don’t know of you have been over to CH’s site, but the new chapter is up. YYou have to click on the Dead in the Family Chapter. I would just like to day that things look pretty good between Sookie and Eric. *Sigh* I cannot wait to read the rest of the book!
lmao, day…say….ugh.
Thanks again Osterby. Just my luck I’ll have to wait. Doing a Christmas Light Tour with friends.
The first Chapter was already released :
http://www.charlaineharris.com/DeadReck_1.html
Sookie & my Viking are still togather in Ch 1 at least..lol !!
i havent read too much from the Beell fans about this book?? or what they thought?? IDK, if many of them read the later books anymore??
anyway, Eric is still awsome in this chapter & he is still the GREATEST character CH invented …
Chapter 3 released:
http://us.penguingroup.com/nf/Book/BookDisplay/0,,9780441020317,00.html?sym=EXC
(link fixed)
Oh delicious! Can’t wait to read this tonight when I get home!
Thank you for fixing the link Renee.
Thanks BG-I printed it at work and read it as soon as I got home. Rut ro….Eric seems to be acting really high handed. Raise your keyboard if you think Claude and Dermot didn’t return to Sookie’s because there are
guests(?) of Victors. May I just say how much I love Pam…
@osterby- I’m a bit suspicious of Claude and Dermot. They could have more motive to be with Sookie than just fae bonding.
They could also be captives of Victor.
What about the “human” waiter that warned her about the glasses. How does he know about fairies and the effect they have on vampires.
If she was able to read his mind, I don’t think he’s fae hiding his scent.
She can’t read fairies, right? Unless he deliberately let her hmmm….
I love Pam too. It was painful to read about Eric and her having some sort of major disagreement.
What about the “human” waiter that warned her about the glasses. How does he know about fairies and the effect they have on vampires.
Whatever Claude and Dermot’s motives for moving in with Sookie, it looks like Victor his interfered with their plans. How would he capture two fairies?
If Victor did capture either Claude or Dermot, one fae could be looking for the other and that’s the reason for being MIA at Sook’s. It’s unlikely that 2 could be captured. Maybe they were in separate places?
Excatly?? how did Victor catch two Fariry’s?? plus since Victor & Felipe are awear of Niall they might be trying to start the damn Fae vs. Vamps war??
did anyone else think it was mighty weird that in DR chapter 3 Victor tried to lace (rub) Fairy blood on the glasses of Eric & Pam’s (to gain some sort of crazy reaction from them) & Eric drained Colmen in DITF & kept his composure .. i mean Eric didnt go all wild & crazy after eating Colman & Colman was a Pure Fae..
& what did you guys think about the conversation between Sookie & Kennedy ( about killing her husband) & at the end Eric chockes out Pam??
plus it looks like to me CH might be getting rid of Sam soon ( maybe in one of the future books).. Sookie kept mentioning how Merlotte’s isnt making money now since Victor opened all his business..
The fairy laced glasses may have been more of an experiment than anything else. I think Victor would have been satisfied if Eric’s judgement was impaired rather than making him berserk.
So maybe this apparant political marriage thing can put Eric in a position to give permission for Pam to turn her gf? That may be why Pam is so intent on Sookie knowing as she thinks Sookie will either help or get angry at Eric ending in a split. The only reason Eric has to refuse something like that is because of Sookie. So either way its a win win situation for Pam. I can understand Eric getting angry at Pam if she is trying to tell Sookie for her own agenda.
That’s a really interesting angle to the potential arranged marriage. I really hate to see Eric and Pam’s interests conflicting, though. Drat CH! Why can’t she just let everyone be happy?
i have thought for a many years that CH’s plan was to Crown the Viking at the end..
on TB AB gave it to us early in his interpretation of the books plus , i think CH gives AB a heads up on what she has planed anyway…
in the books IMO Eric is Sookie’s “soul Mate” & it was shown very early in the books.. i think AB changed alot of things for the purpose of keeping Bill active on the show & frankly since Bill ( SM) is a lead on the show he really cant die out till at least the end of the show.. so AB for the moment sort of made Show Bill “untouchable” ..
as for the books though, Eric will become King at the end & therfore, this will be the “non traditional HAE” CH mentioned.. CH said Sookie wont have kids & she said Sookie will have great sex at the end…
I agree. Eric is going to be king. I just can’t decide if he’s going to be king of LA or some kind of high king.
oooh , what do you mean “High King”?? like a “High preist”?? Eric is a preist already in the books.. if Eric ends up killing Felipe than wont he take over all the states naturally & maybe issue Pam a state to be Queen of ( sort of like Victor was hoping Felipe would do for him when Felipe gained LA & Ark)??
To keep Sookie safe, he’s probably going to have to be more than just the king of LA. Maybe he will end up with Philipe’s empire or over all the monarchs in N. America.
Renee : “To keep Sookie safe, he’s probably going to have to be more than just the king of LA. Maybe he will end up with Philipe’s empire or over all the monarchs in N. America”.
WOOT WOOT !! i love that idea Renee ( Eric over all the Monarchs in N.America).. but DAMN he would have to be the oldest vampire i guess if that happens..
otherwise, he would always have someone challenging him.. & Sookie said one of the reason’s he never seeked Kingship in the past was because your always a target.. but that was way back in FDTW (book 
before the Take Over.. Now the way things are by DR (book 11) Eric will have to be King of something( besides the G.P.) **snort** ..ROTFLMFAO !! this is what the Bill fans hate so much about Eric’s character is the fact that he is older & stronger than Bill & has a political position & ect..ect..ect.. .
I just read a review of Dead reckoning and i am now breathing a sigh of relief, no mention of political marriages or breaking up. Looks like they are all embarking on a dangerous quest, Eric and Pam plan to kill their master while Sookie joins them to keep them safe.
Whew! I really wasn’t looking foreword to that.
so far IMO between the 2 chapter’s that CH has released of this book so far i find a few things very interesting in DR..
1. the fact that Niall might be back to assist Eric in a future battle ( vampire war or something) Sookie mentions how Niall would fight with Eric on the same team..
2. the Fact that Eric & Sookie find it suspicious that Claude & Dermot are living with her
3. the fact that Sookie kept mentioning the failure of Merlotte’s maybe staying in business & she even mentions getting another waitressing job at a dinner..( so IMO maybe CH will move Sam away at some point ?? (maybe book 13 Sam tell’s Sookie he is moving back to TX since we have the Compaion Book comming out this year as well)..
I that wedding Sam and Sookie are supposed to go to is going to be important, too.
Right, in The Compaion Book Sam & Sookie travel to TX for Sam’s brother’s wedding.. he is from TX orginally.. Quinn is suppose to be in the Compaion Book as well.. so the supposed book timeline of this wedding must be after DAG & DITF since in book 10 Sam asked Sookie to go with him & she hasent told Eric yet that she said yes.. maybe in DR Sookie tell’s Eric that she agreed to travel out of state with Sam to TX.. Sam’s werewolf girlfriend “Jannalyn” who Sookie said has a reputation of “Cracking Skulls” wont like this either i bet..
Victor wants Sookie dead as it is so i suspect Eric wont be pleased with Sookie going across statelines with Sam..
plus in the short story “Two Blondes” Felipe is trying to gain Mississippi so Russell is in trouble.. & so is Stan in TX as well.. Felipe wants or seeks both states..
but notice how in Chapter 3 of DR Sookie wants to know what is going on with Eric & that mystery letter & the regular politics of it all.. Sookie already is self awear of Victor’s attempts on her life from DITF & Chapter 1 of DR with the fire bombing of Merlottes.. yet she is still going with Sam to this TX wedding & will travel through alot of Victor’s territory..
a small spoiler of DR’s book activity & what to expect in the book :
http://tinyurl.com/3qxnw4z
it appears that it’s possible the Mystery letter came from a vampire Queen..
Just read the link to 5 min- 5 questions for CH posted by IATM.
It seems there will be a fight at FT. At least I think the reference was to DR. I don’t recall any other fights at FT. Who and who and why? Exciting!
Maybe Victor will die in the Fangtasia fight??
Somebody is going to die. Is there a new bartender? If there is she/he is toast. Just like the guys in Star Trek that wore the odd colour uniform. You knew they were going to buy it shortly.
Could be tricky for Eric if Victor dies. There would have to be a very good reason i.e. self defence or defence of Pam.
LOL, i’m just busting up that it appears Fredja has paper’s to claim Eric for marriage..
Sookie wont like this i gather.. even though she has been complaining about being married to Eric since DAG..
i wonder if Fredja can null & void Eric’s marriage to Sookie??
THAT is going to be a can of worms. I’m trying to stay away from too many spoilers and it’s so hard, so I don’t think I can even hazard a guess. It’s only 2 more weeks.
well at the end of the day Eric still has the knife he used to marry himself to Sookie back in ATD..
& it’s a hoot that Sandra P. is back causing Sookie problems .. **shake head** Debbie’s sister..
Oh man, Sandra Pelt. As much of a pain in the butt as Debbie.
The knife, I forgot all about it. Wonder if it will figure in DR? Don’t tell me if you know.
Nope I dont know.. i just know that Eric still has the knife.. but i speculate he will use it maybe in another book after Fredja dies or something to maybe “ask” Sookie to re-marry him?? or maybe the knife reappears or something?? it’s all guesses.. i just know that Eric still has it since he had it in DAG.. & CH might bring it back up..
Here is DR’s book review from True blood.net :
http://true-blood.net/2011/04/22/sookie-at-the-crossroads-an-advance-review-of-dead-reckoning/
Thanks IATM. I couldn’t stay away. *hangs head in shame*. I’m weak.
Me too…BG…me too:(
Do you think the Easter Bunny will still come to our house osterby, even though we gave in? I like biting the ears off first.
on Sookieverse she gave a Character by Character evoluation of DR from what she has read already: she must have got an advanced copy of the book..
http://www.sookieverseblog.com/2011/04/29/sookies-dead-reckoning/
i think CH is totaly building up to Sookie ending up with Eric in book 13.. so it makes me wonder why AB changed so much stuff on TB??
I’ve put myself on a DR moratoreum until after I read it, but feel free to keep the discussion going and the links coming. I’m sure I’ll be checking them out after I’ve formed my own opinion.
I’m resisting too. But it’s so hard. Successful so far. I think I’ve been able to resist the temptation because it’s only a few more days. I’m a big girl I can do it.
Think I’ll watch S1 or 2 just so I don’t cave.
I also have the copy but can you believe it, no one was at home so my hubby is picking it up now. He knows the weekend is blocked for Sookie/Eric time until I finish it and as it’s just a few hours away I’m staying far away from SVB’s review.
I wanna know how people are getting copies of the book ahead of the release date. I can understand SVB getting a copy…but there are posters on SVB who have already read it and one poster even said she was going to go pick up a copy today…
osterby, I pre-ordered it but lots of book stores already unpacked it (at least in Europe).
Finished DR and loved it very much! I was a bit disappointed after DITF and this book felt sooo much better. Sookie is back to the way I started loving her. Pam is a true friend and Eric… whoa, don’t want to spoil your pleasure but he’s got a hell of a lot on his plate. All in all CH has done a great job and the year until the next one will feel even longer…
It’s so good to hear that everything is as it should be! Now I’m even more excited!
Lucky you white lily. I’m still resisting any more spoilers. I’ve only read 2 reviews from about a week ago. That was enough. Must…keep….busy. Only a few more days.
Glad you enjoyed it.
@Bobsgran, I also avoided the latest spoilers as the closer it got to the book the more detailed they got.
@Renée, it is indeed and even Beel has his moments, I hate to admit…LOL
are you guys serious???
competing between the Royal wedding & DR & Thor i have been spoiler crazy **snort**
well, i’m still waiting for Thor & DR because i dont want to spoil for those who dont have the book yet.. the movie i’m still waiting..lol !!
IATM- the Royal Wedding pfft. Got real tired of all the stuff on TV this week. Although I have to admit that nobody does pomp and circumstance like the Brits.
Thor- I’ll wait for the DVD.
DR- One more day. So near and yet so far.
I’m a real crabby guts today. It’s raining AGAIN, I forget what the sun looks like.
hey BG,
i just love Comic book Movies ( Batman is my Hubby’s fav, & X men is my fav).. so the Thor movie will be watched in this house..LOL !! my Hubby is more comic books than i, & i just read more regular books..
i got my DR book yesterday.. but i wont discuss it untill you guys all have the book.. ( that way, it will be a real discussion).. the royal wedding had me laughing personally just because of the hat wear ( head wear).. but i liked the wedding dress..
Where did you find it without crossing an ocean?
I reordered the Kindle version so I’m contemplating downloading it at midnight. If I do that I know I’ll be up all night reading and shit for work.
i ordered my book last year & it arrived yesterday..
Yah, the dress was a classic. He looked quite dashing in the red uniform. Yah, I watched. I’m a sap. Besides, all I’m getting in the GWN is election stuff and it’s really annoying. That ends tomorrow, thank the gods.
Can’t relate to the comic book stuff. But I’m sure I’ll enjoy all the manly heavage when it comes out on DVD.
I loved the dress and all the pomp and circumstance. I wish American women wore hats at weddings.
Once you get enough Basel Cell Carcinomas, believe me, you start wearing hats. Whether they are appropriate or not. I have a substantial collection, for most occasions and for everyday wear.
Once you get enough Basel Cell Carcinomas, believe me, you start wearing hats. Whether they are appropriate or not. I have a substantial collection, for most occasions and for everyday wear.
Lady, we have a lot in common. I too started a substantial collection of hats after having a Basal Cell Carcinoma removed from my chin.:( Too much teenaged ‘frying like a fritter in a pan’. I always did love hats though I just felt stupid wearing them before I had a good excuse!
Thirty three years of working outside as a letter carrier did me in. You can’t stop in the middle of your day and wash off and reapply some 45 SPF. Just not practical. 5 more spots being removed shortly. Wear those hats with panache girl.
5 more spots being removed shortly
Wow girl, good luck and I hope that’s the end of that!
Wear those hats with panache girl.
Lol! I’m particularly fond of my straw Boater with wide black band, and my brown felt Cloche. Those take some doing to wear with any credibility, so I’m usally in a baseball cap or plain straw sun hat.
I’m afraid the 5 soon to be ex spots aren’t going to be the end. Dermatologist keeps checking the arms and legs. All I can say is thank goodness for our health care system. Hasn’t cost me a cent so far.
The black ribboned Boater sounds very Chanel.
The black ribboned Boater sounds very Chanel.
That’s the idea though the execution leaves a little to be desired.
What’s so annoying about working outside in the sun is the hot, heavy sunblock. It makes me sweat like all get out! I’d love to find a light and airy spf that actually works.
Take care. My soon-to-be step mama just had one removed and has started a hat collection of her own.
Ask if your dermatologist sells a sun block. They’re usually more expensive but I found it isn’t as heavy as some of the drug store brands. And it’s 50 spf.
You know what’s funny Renee? Back in the day it was considered much more preferable to have a visage as pale as milk. I’m thinking of the BBQ scene in GWTW. Scarlett wasn’t supposed to look like a field hand who worked outside all day.
Ha! That was back in the day when bulging muscles on a man was the mark of a manual laborer. Gentlemen kept fit with gymnastics which made them strong without bulking them up and spoiling the line of their suits,
Yep, a tanned face on a woman and bulging muscles on a man were considered vulgar and low class.
Oh goodness, I forgot about that. I guess todays young men are under just as much pressure from Hollywood and advertising as young women. Sad.
Did anyone notice Prince William is going Bald?? he is too young for that IMO.. Prince Harry looked good as well in uniform IMO..
IATM, I guess it’s genetic.
That started happening to my brother in college. After his sophomore year, he was never without a hat. Turns out male pattern baldness runs in our mother’s family, but after generations of only females in the line, no realized it until we went back and looked at old photos of our great-grandmother’s brothers.
yea i know, but not like i know the entire Royal family or anything.. but i didnt even notice if Charles was bald as well.. LOL !! & i was like damn, William is going bald already & he is only 29..
Like I told my son, embrace the Jean Luc Picard look and wear it proud. Cause there’s nothing you can do about it.
maybe being a Royal is stressful..**snort** & that is why he is going bald so young.. i really didnt expect it though.. i thought William was so handsome in his younger yrs.. now Harry looks better IMO.. LOL !!
but all & all i thought he picked a wonderful bride.. she was stunning IMO & i really liked the dress.. the young blood will be refreshing when they take their seats on the throne IMO..
now Harry looks better IMO.. LOL !!
You mean Prince Hot Ginge?
ooh my, the “E” channel was talking about Prince Harry as the “worlds” most goodlooking single guy now.. & i could have sworn he invited his girlfriend to the wedding..LOL !! they showed a picture of her..
IATM by the time they get to take the throne they won’t be so young. The Windsor’s are a long lived lot. Grandma is 85 and going strong, then comes HRH Charles turn, then William. Great Grandma, The Queen Mother was over 100 yrs. old.
That is so wild to me.. i heard that Charles will “have” to get it to his son when Grandma dies?? is that a rumor??
because he divorced Di??
Nope. Ain’t gonna happen. They are so touchy after Edward abdicated in the ’30′s for the women he loved, there is no way baring death he will not take his turn. Besides, Diana has passed. He is at present married to a woman (Camilla) who is divorced. But that won’t stop him taking the throne. There are lots of ifs ands and buts in their system.
wow !! then William & Kate wont make it to the throne then maybe by the time they are in their 50′s or 60′s..
but anyway, i find that whole system so interesting.. at first i thought Kate might have a wedding dress that didnt have traps.. ( you know Modern & all) & then when i saw the dress i figured it must be the custom that she remains covered ( even though she dated him for 10 years).. & are “we” suppose to beleive she didnt have sex with the Prince in the entire 10 year span?? or were we just going for “Traditional” look??
i did like the dress though ..
I think there are do’s and don’ts about what can be uncovered at Westminster Abby. Something about not showing the elbows.
And yes the dress was traditional, but I liked it too. This was a Royal wedding not a Hollywood spectacle, doncha know. LOL
At least she’ll be able to look back in 25yrs. and not say “What the hell was I thinking”.
LOL very true indeed
woops i mean “give up the throne” due to his divorce?? is that a rumor?? or is it true??
There are lots of ifs and buts as Bobsgran says, but the rules can be changed. What happens might depend on how Charles & Camilla are seen by the public at the time. The Firm, as it’s called sometimes, is all about survival.
That is so true anna. And that’s something they know how to do. They been at it for eons.
Happy reading to all the bookies.. today is the Big day of the DR release.. hope you all enjoy the book so we can discuss it..
Somebody needs to spoil me ASAP!
here is a Billy spoiler :
Sookie is running in the rain because she is being chased & she takes off her clothes & runs to Bill’s house & she is stark naked.. so guess what happens?? Billy flirts with a naked Sookie & doesnt rape her (agian)
my guess is that this was CH’s way of redeeming Billy the rapist.. Go Figure !!
Sookie breaks the Blood Bond in DR also with Amelia’s help & she finds out ( guess what)??.. that she still LOVES the Viking **snort** like none of us Eric fans saw that comming right?? LOL !!
anyway, i’m going to start my second read of the book today so all the info is fresh in my mind..
I’ve just started so I’ll be holed up for awhile.
i find Sam so annoying in DR so far..
he has reached a new level of being a HATER …
at the end of the day CH wrote this book with question in mind :
is Sookie going to fight for Eric??
Eric already told her what he is giving up to be with her in DR ( they are still married & yet the blood bond is broke).. RICHES BIT*CH’S (is what Eric is giving up to be with Sookie & keep her safe) & Queen Fredja is a good looking women on top of it.. what does Sookie bring to the table expect (her telepathy)?? & the fact that Eric loves her.. so once agian since Sookie is the protagonist the ball is in her court..
is Eric worth fighting for?? is the end resut & question.. LOL !! & we have 2 more books for Sookie to decide on that answer **snort**
A dead letter day here!! I went to find the book this morning, came home put the radio on and read it til the end…OMG I couldn’t put it down!! Amidst my reading bonanza, my mailperson dropped of the newest issue of the comic book!!
I loved that Sookie realised that the BB wasn’t what made her want to be with Eric!
I ewwwwed at the ice pack!
Laughed at Bill naked in the corner of the cellar!!
Scratched my head why Sookie decided she needed to be naked in Bill’s house.
Loved that she poohooed Bill’s advance!
Questions:
What was Cataliades warning Sookie about the Hooligan’s?
Who is after Cataliades?
What will Sookie use the cluviel dor for?
Just finished and am still trying to wrap my head around a few things.
The questions you ask osterby are the some of the same ones I have.
One observation albeit on first reading. That stuff with Bill and her naked in his hole. I thought it was forced. Like CH was trying too hard to make Bill an ok guy after all. I still think he’s a shit.
Something that annoyed me was Sookie taking the blame for everything, with the odd exception, on herself.
I also felt a coldness between her and Eric, despite the sex scene, which was not what it’s cracked up to be in a few of the reviews I did read. That whole scene seemed perfunctory to me. Does that make sense to anyone? Maybe it’s just me.
I don’t like Sam. Sure he’s a good friend, but he has the worst taste in women. He keeps getting involved with violent or deceitful
creatures.
Even though I enjoyed reading this instalment, I kind of feel CH has gone to the well too often. Maybe she should have wrapped things up before now. And there are still 2 more books to go.
I think I’m going to be in the minority with some of my thoughts.
Maybe a second reading will change some of the perceptions I have.
Hi everyone…popping in belatedly on your convo:
@Bobsgran, I had similar feelings about the porch sex scene. I mean, it didn’t disturb me or anything, but I didn’t find it that hot. I think it’s because there was so much emotional distance and just horrible communication between those two. I do absolutely love the fact that they are both really clear that they love each other without the bond and that they said so unequivocally. They also still want each other sexually without the bond. I guess I see Sookie’s willingness to have enthusiastic porch swing sex as character growth on her part in a way.
I get what you are saying about her being naked with Bill. I thought it was both a brave and potentially reckless thing for her to do, considering her particular history with Bill in the trunk, but it really was a matter of life and death. I also couldn’t help but be amused and actually have some respect for Bill in this book. He still does totally Bill stuff (like his comment about Miss America Tit Competition… classy Bill!!), but I guess in a way, I felt glad that Sookie had moved that far beyond some of her previous trauma to be able to handle herself in that situation without panicking and having some kind of PTSD moment. Of course, if Bill hadn’t controlled himself so well, I would feel totally differently about it. Also, Sookie really called him on the fact that he would have been interested whether she were naked in his resting place or not…and he totally admitted it, so at least she isn’t pretending to herself or Bill that she doesn’t know what is up with him.
I agree that Sam’s taste in girlfriends totally sucks. I noticed that he seemed to be having doubts about his own perceptions of what Jannalynn was like, though, when he and Sookie were at the antique shop. I really hope the fact that Jannalynn and Sam both know where the fairy portal is doesn’t come back and bite Sookie in the ass.
I actually thought Sookie showed a great deal more self awareness in this book and a willingness to confront things head on. She still did somethings that drove me nuts, like waiting a whole day (or however long that was) to actually read Gran’s letter. I was screaming to myself that after her experience with the ceremonial knife with Eric, that she had better hurry up and see what was in that velvet bag. I was afraid it would get taken before she could read it and see what it was!! I also thought she stood up for herself very well in several instances, especially in that WTF scene with Alcide.
I enjoyed how fast paced this book was, although, it did kind of make my head spin and I could not put it down.
Hi Jayetea. I guess I should give Bill a break, but he sets my teeth on edge no matter what he does.
True that Sookie is showing more self awareness. She is asking about things more. It’s the times she leaps before she thinks that drive me nuts.
@Bobsgran, You don’t have to give Bill a break if you don’t want to!!! I guess it’s just a relief to know that Bill doesn’t seem to be hiding stuff from Sookie anymore. I had been rereading books 6-8 in preparation for DR coming out and Bill is such a shit in those books in so many ways, that I just found him funny in this book. I mean, he still clearly can’t let go of Sookie and totally wants to have sex with her, but he’s up front about it and she knows about it and she doesn’t seem uncomfortable or threatened by it, so I guess I’m not eithr at this point. I do think he was a shit to Judith and I really hope that doesn’t fall back on Sookie’s head. I also appreciated the advice he gave her about Eric and it seemed like he really was talking to her as a friend and not as someone who eternally wants to get back in her pants (even though he does).
Yeah, Sookie still does things that drive me nuts too. I think she’s come a long way, though, so I have hope!
I guess I have hope too. Otherwise I wouldn’t be reading the books.
Poor Bill…he just never quite gets it…does he? Seemed to me that CH was doing just what she said…she said maybe she was having just one last fling with Bill.
I think she pretty much placed him in the “charring his ass on the back burner” position by writing Bill admitting that he knew Sookie loves Eric and Poor Judith…like Bill didn’t know that she was there in the tree line…
I agree about the sex scene…meh…I wanted lemons, more lemons! Perhaps the coldness you are feeling is Eric’s uncertain position in the marriage deal. He was certainly keeping it from Sookie.
I agree about Sam’s choice in women…what the heck was the deal with her prodding Alcide to go after Sookie?
I am soooo disappointed with Amelia and her big fat mouth!
HAHA great questions all around you two..
plus since Victor is dead & we only have to worry about Felipe..foreshadowing so much ..
Nope a second reading still leaves you in a loop really if your looking for a bunch of answer’s..
this book had so many disappointments & grand things IMO..
Sookie breaking the BB is cool.. but in book 12 it will be a problem because it was foreshadowed in DR..
Sookie giving Sam money for a failing business?? why is that a choice instead of college?? she still lacks ambition & her own dreams in life..
the sex scene on the porch was wack IMO as well.. but the words that were used are more towrads a foreshadowing since CH already gave a clue to Sookie’s HAE in book 13..
Sookie is more problems then she is worth actually.. so my opinion differ’s..
Osterby & IATM, I agree, Bill doesn’t get it. He’s still obsessed with her and I think poor Judith is going to cause some problems for him and her in the future. Women/vampire scorned and all that. That was nasty letting Judith overhear his conversation. No guts to tell her to her face, thanks for saving my life, but bugger off.
Lemons? I don’t know what that scene on the porch was, but it sure wasn’t lemons.
Amelia to me was treacherous, not just impulsive. There definitely will be more to her stunt in the future. And she knows about that little love token Sookie has from Adele. If she shot her mouth off at the Hair of the Dog, where else?
Jannalyne/Sam/Alcide. Janna is jealous of the relationship between Sookie and Sam. Alcide has to be dumb as a stump if he thought his bedroom stunt would work. His own agenda notwithstanding. He too will create more problems.
And last but not least, the fae. We will surely see more of them. That porthole in her woods isn’t just for letters back and forth.
The fact that Fintan was able to change form (disguising himself as Adele’s husband) to me screams that some other fae is able to do the same thing. Betcha Claude is looking for that cluviel dor. Which reminds me that Sam knows about it now too, thanks to
Amelia. He also mentioned access to a library supes have.
Sookie has that Damn Fairy magic thingy that grants her a wish for a loved one..
i bet Sookie will use it on the Queen Fredja situation in book 12..
plus Sookie is such a hyprocrite in DR.. Eric even called her on it..LOL !! it’s really becomming annoying..
Felipe will find out a couple things i think were foreshadowed in DR..
1. he is going to find out that Sookie broke the BB.. plus Sookie told Billy she broke so shouldnt she be more cautious at this point telling everyone?? DUMB & DUMBER we go **sigh**
2. Sookie has nothing to really to offer Eric except for the Telepathy & the fact that he loves her..
IMO Sookie at Fangtasia during the fight scene & kill of victor was so lame.. her presence in that scene was really to give us the “what occured”.. but she really didnt need to be there.. she still puts her life in harms way for someone who talks about she wants to live..
what a nut job.. i think CH really created a weak protagonist on so many levels..
I actually liked the fight scene at FT. I did accept the explanation that Victor would become suspicious if she wasn’t there.
I don’t think she has accepted her position in the supe world. She is constantly yearning for a normal life. Working at Merlottes, having a baby shower for Tara, asking Mr. C if there is a way to be rid of her gift. I think she is in deep denial.
she is in deep denile.. i agree with that..
i liked the fight scene, but i didnt really think Sookie’s presence was really needed .. i mean geesh, just because Victor comes to Fangtasia Sookie has to be there all the time??
i think Sookie’s denile is what bother’s me the most.. on & on for chapter’s complaining about this & that her moral conflict.. she feels about 50/50 of the BB being broke.. but for so many books all she did was complain about the BB & she was the one to ask Ameila to look into breaking it in DITF.. so now it’s broke & she feels 50/50.. the good thing is that Eric said that was what kept her safe not really the marriage.. so Felipe will be the problem now..
Yup. She’s up for grabs.
Excatly,
so she is up for grabs now & so is Eric in a sense.. Oklahoma really wants Eric.. **snort**
@Bobsgran,
I also agree that Amelia’s actions were treacherous and not just impulsive. I think she is under her father’s thumb. Copley Carmichael is bad news; he did that background check on Sookie in FDTW; he knew that Hunter existed before Sookie did. He asked Sookie to hook him up with reps from the Nevada regime. Amelia isn’t stupid and she knows a great deal about the supernatural world. The fact that she intentionally went to the Hair of the Dog is just unbelievable. I wonder if she really does blame Sookie for Tray’s death as well. Although, you’d think Sookie would have picked up on that from Amelia’s head…idk. I also think that Pam, regardless of whatever genuine interest and/or attraction she had for Amelia, was feeding Eric info on what Amelia was up to. I wish Sookie hadn’t asked her about the cluviel dor as well. Not good. At least she doesn’t know for sure that Sookie has one.
I am worried that Alcide will turn against Sookie and become vindictive, even though he was a total dumbass and I don’t know how he possibly could have thought that would have worked with her. I agree that Jannalynn is threatened by Sam and Sookie’s relationship. I understand why she’d be pissed that Sam took Sookie to a family wedding out of state, though.
The whole Fintan disguising himself as Mitchell Stackhouse is super creepy and definitely suggests that other fae are capable of the same thing. I agree that Claude either alrady is or will be looking for the cluviel dor.
I am dying to know more about Mr. Cataliadies relationship with Fintan, Dermot and Niall.
Jayetea. Yup all that.
The Mr. C. mystery is going to be good, I think. We just don’t know enough about that demon.
Yeah, I agree. I love that his first name is Desmond, for some reason. Desmond the demon. I guess I am easily amused sometimes. I’d love to read a short story starring Mr. C and Diantha! Maybe somebody will write some good fanfic.
What do you think will be the fallout from Victor’s death IATM? Will everyone keep their mouths shut or will Eric stand trial?
i think we will have a summit in a future book.. ( i think book 12 )
Oh yah IATM. There’s going to be a trial at some summit. And the prospective queen bride isn;t going to give up easily.
yea, & Sookie will go to the summit & most likely carry that DAMN “Cluviel Dor” Fae one wish magic thing.. LOL !!
i’m glad that CH created Oklahoma attractive .. it seems like Bill’s role in DR was simply to tell Sookie some more that he loves her still & that Oklahoma is rich & that Eric would be giving up alot to be with Sookie.. & then throw another compliment that Sookie is attractive & Eric likes beatuty… Geesh, what a really wack point..
Thinking about Mr. C. So he’s kind of Sookie’s godfather? Who the heck is chasing him. Bad investments for someone…lol
& what is the deal with Sam??
Sam it appared feels that Sookie should date Claude or Dermott?? ( a family member)?? just as Sam way back in DAAD thought Sookie should marry Calvin & be his breeder for the were panther’s.. now Sam thinks Sookie should date a Fae.. Geesh !!
then the whole conversation about do people change?? i was shaking my head.. i wonder if Sookie will ever change & grow up??
To me she is growing up a bit more. At least she is asking questions, looking for more information. But she has to accept who and what she is before she can move on. In her head she knows what she is, but it isn’t in her heart.
very true,
she is a hyprocrite though BIG TIME..
Mr. Cataliads is responsible for Sookie’s telepathy & i thought that was sort of corny.. but oh well..
i’m really looking forward to Niall showing up in the future book..
Ah yes Niall. Fintan able to change form reminded me of the fae pretending to be a Were in the woods in Gift Wrap. He mentioned to one of his co-horts that his ability to change was a family trait. Wonder if he was related to Fintan? And if Fintan was able to change form, what about papa Niall. Egad, I’m creeping myself out.
I’d hesitate to call her a hypocrite. I think it’s fear. Deep into her soul fear. Everything she was taught growing up has been upended.
her family dynamics is on the weird side.. but who’s family isnt..
the hyprocrite stuff is Sookie’s moral code about death & murder & ect..ect.. it’s all good when she has to kill someone, but when other people do it she is all in a uproar.. that dialouge get’s old..
considering everything that Sookie has been through between the 11 books.
That does seem to be a struggle for her. However, she does have some remorse for having to do the things she does. If she didn’t, I’d be more worried.
yea the remorse is natural.. & since Sookie consider’s herself to be Christin like..
but you cant have it both ways.. i mean really!! this is the problem.. no matter if Sookie is with a vampire or a were animal or a human or a witch .. she has already commited murder a few times already.. & came up with plans to kill people.. so her preachyness all the time goes stale.. how remorsfull is she?? she always say’s it’s either their life or mines because she wants to live..
I think the preachiness is her internal struggle to come to terms with what she has done. If she can come to terms with it. Are all the supes God’s creatures too.
well i would assume that the Supes are Gods creature’s since they exsist..
just as Dinosours exsisted at one point..
but it seems like no matter what Sookie’s life is full of chaos.. & unless she decides to stop murdering folks & call the police sometimes to just arrest them she will continue to kill to live..
that Shape Shifting Fae’s name was Preston..
maybe Sookie already slept with a relative??
Niall sent Presten to Sookie for a 1 night stand in Gift Wrap.. the incest thing really bother’s me as well..
anyway, Fintin had the gift to change form & Idenity or whatever.. & Niall has the gift to mask his scent..
all in all i think Mr. Cataliads broke down the Telepathy gift to Sookie & Hunter very well.. plus i think he explained some of her Fairy back ground well enough for me..
i think it makes sense why Sookie wont have any kids at the end as part of her HEA.. CH said Sookie wont.. i think Sookie will make that choice because of everything Mr. Cataliads explained to her in DR..
I believe Niall has more than 1 or 2 gifts. He just hasn’t shared that information.
possibly.. that will be cool if Niall does have more gifts.. he is the Fairy Prince afterall.. & he is also very wealthy.. but out of the 3 things that CH droped as Sookie’s HEA IDK, what difference Niall’s other gifts will be??
i think Niall will end up showing up for the Felipe battle..
You could be right. But I sure don’t trust his motives.
the Fae are on the creepy side ..
i thought it was sort of interesting that Eric told Sookie he did business with Niall way back it sounds like when Sookie was dating Billy..
Eric contacted Niall & told him that Sookie was in danger.. this was before DD & FDTW.. Niall sends Claudine to watch over Sookie.. HAHA
That’s going to come back and bite him. The fact that he kept this information from her.
IDK, & at this point it seems like it doesnt matter.. i dont know why Eric would have told Sookie way back in DUD that he knew Niall?? or way back in LDID that he knew Niall .. Claudine made her first apperance in the books in CD..
so Eric would have had to talk to Niall before CD or sometime during CD events..
But i tell you what.. CH made it very clear that Niall was talking about Eric in DAG when he told Sookie ” The vampire loves you”..
Niall favor’s Eric it was told to us in DR..
I guess I’m being overly critical of Niall’s motives. I keep thinking “What’s in it for me”. Hope I’m wrong.
what was in it for Niall IMO was meeting his kin Sookie..
remember they said he was looking for her & yada,yada,yada.. maybe something else is up??
Oh I doubt it was just to meet Sookie. Those fae are as devious as vamps.
i wonder if Niall wants the “Cluviel Dor” ??
i cant wait to find out what the reprecussion are going to be once Sookie uses the damn thing.. see how nothing is easy.. as soon as she uses it it’s gonna change history in some manner..
i think she is going to use it on the Oklahoma situation.. so i keep going over in my head what the reprecussion will be..
True, it may not matter. It’s just thinking about how she hates having her life managed by someone else. She has a hard time accepting help sometimes.
i actually think Eric did a good thing.. because the outcome was Niall sending Claudine to be her fairy god mother.. Niall didnt meet Sookie face to face till FDTW & it makes sense why he went through Eric to do that meeting even more now..
notice that Sookie wasent even upset when she found all this stuff out in DR.. & Eric didnt know Bill’s mission way back in DUD & LDID.. & CD Sookie did put her life in danger..
plus Mr. Catalaids already warned Sookie to not let anyone know she has that “Cluviel Dor” because they will try to kill her for it..
so you know Claude or Dermott or someone at Claudes Hooligans club will find out about it & the Fae’s will be after Sookie agian..
Unfortunately RL intrudes. I will catch up later.
So the book was good…not great as some people said. And the sex porch scene…really…ummm no.
Amelia…sigh. WTF was that? I was so happy she kicked them all out of the house. She seems to really be getting sick and tired of people manipulating her. It’s time for Claude to go. ASAP!
Bill…not so bad…still a jerk but really CH…stop trying to erase that rape for heaven sake! She needs to stop listening to the BL’s talk. She had a reason to write him that way in the beginning and I don’t see why that has changed.
Oh and WTF is up with Eric beating up Pam! I realize she is vampire but we are beating up women now? I HATED that scene. Couple that with Fintan manipulating Gran and I will say CH has women troubles.
I need to do a re-read but it’s a mixed bag to me.
yea, it did seem like DR was all over the place..
how about the scene at fangtasia when Eric was feeding on Sookie & appearently didnt want to stop & Billy drove her home ect..ect..
i was shaking my head.. to top off the naked hidey hole / no rape scene CH wrote yet another corny situation.. Sookie offer’s her blood to Eric & he called her a hyprocrite & he doesnt want to stop feeding on her..
**hand to forehead** CH is getting corny IMO a wee bit..
But doesn’t it seem like she is just totally caving to the BL’s? I have a real problem when people try to redeem rapist (General Hospital,I am looking at you) And it’s not as if people who rape are all beyond repair but don’t re-write history to make it work. That’s hog wash.
Is there a reason for making Eric especially violent in this book? Beating up Pam, biting Sookie. I don’t get it.
the Pam & Eric fight he still used control.. because Eric could have ordered Pam to stop fighting because “i’m your maker” & he didnt.. aw, those famous words of dictatorship..
i thought that Pam had made some great points also like ” see, she goes shopping with other men, she sleeps with other men, what kinda husband are you???
Sookie does a whole lot of Bull shit & most of the time causes alot of silly shit.. like her naked scene with Billy in his hidey hole.. would if Billy would have raped her agian?? she put herself in that situation.. she is still way more often then not still too trusting” & she loves getting compliments & yet does silly things..
nope I am not buying that. “And Eric launched himself across the table, hands extended toward Pam’s throat”. What he could have done/ should have done was ordered her to shut up. There seems to have been converstation that went on off page that led to that statement. I thought she was pressing him into action. e.i…get in touch with Felippe to get Victor under control. She was on a time crunch as her lover was dying. She needed action and was willing to say anything and everything to make it so.
Jerron I agree that the Pam/Eric fight in the kitchen was bad. I didn’t like it at all. And Eric biting Sookie at FT and not wanting to stop. Didn’t like that either. He has previously shown much more control.
I have a feeling CH wants to distance readers from Eric. To what end, IDK? We’ve seen 2 somewhat brutal sides to Eric and I was stunned by Sookie’s attitude at the end about getting a call from him. Maybe he will maybe he won’t, oh well I’ll watch Jeopardy? The man she says she loves is up a creek without a paddle and she is so blase.
To me that does not speak well for their relationship, regardless of what some readers may want.
Exactly! And CH has talked herself into a corner because she has said this won’t happen and that won’t happen so then the question arises what is Sookie’s HEA? Are we now making Eric look brutal to and Her feeling’s ambivalent because she is going to do something stupid with the ending? I mean if it is not Eric then HEA then there had better be some damn good reason as to why.
There is always a Sam possible ending.. but the fact that Sookie has to think about her life & if she really wants to be a mother then its possible her kids or Jason’s kids or even Hunter’s kids could get that Spark & have Telepathy.. & she was thinking about trying to get rid of Hunter’s Telepathy & she claims everyone else is High Handed.. i dont get it?? **sigh**
Thank God Mr. C. told her she couldnt use the Cluviel Dor for that purpose..
& if Pam’s girlfriend didnt die, that would have just created more problems since she was told she wasent allowed & Pam planned on doing it anyway.. & why is it okay for Pam to create a vampire because she loves this person & it’s not okay for Sookie to become a vampire & live with Eric for the rest of her life ( because she likes to sunbath)??
Maybe CH is writing Pam to move away now??
Right,
this is all a serious fact of dating a vampire.. i think CH wants to distance Sookie so that they can break up are something?? IDK !! but the fact that Sookie asked Mr. C if she could use the CD to kill someone & he told her yes, if the person was harming someone she loves.. ( Sookie loves everyone) . then i figure she will use it for that..
the whole situation of her plan to kill Victor & using Bubba was sort of like Eric & Niall did to Terry.. Hyprocrite much.. the fact that oh yea, after the fact of all the killing she has a problem with it..
Eric & Pam fighting was like Bill twisting Lorena’s neck.. the fact that he did it harsh .. & Billy takes her home afterwards.. that scene reminded me of CD when Eric drove her home after she & Bill fought.. & Bill drained her..
Eric claims that he was trying to get in touch with Felipe.. Felipe isnt responding.. besides he will respond now since Victor is dead..
but the fact that Eric could have ordered her to shut up which he did do alot in DR & the fact that he didnt use the order & rank to tell Pam to stop fighting with him.. Pam was planning on turning Miaram anyway even with out the permission, before the women died..
oh yea, the Compaion Book Sam & Sookie attending the wedding occured in past tense in DR.. so they already attended it & Sam’s family thought Sookie & Sam were a couple…
I think this was the source of Sookie’s reluctance to attend the pre-kindergarden with Hunter and Remy. Her comment was that she didn’t want Remy’s Girlfriend to be upset when she found out Sookie was there.
I havent started the second read yet, so I’m basing this observation simply having read some other site opinions.
Some readers seem to be having the same reaction I am. That is, bouncing back and forth between good and bad about the events and characters. I feel like a ping pong ball sometimes.
I’ve read where we shouldn’t judge vamps by human standards (the attack on Pam by Eric as an example), yet this smacks of the same rational BL’s had about Bill’s reasons for doing what he did and betrayed Sookie.
When that reasoning was used there was a indignant cry from many in fandom and condemned. I’m confused. Yes, we are supposed to suspend beliefs because this is after all fantasy fiction. But human standards are the only ones I can relate to. Crap… maybe I’m overthinking.
That’s right BG…I will continue to hold Eric (my fave in the series) to the same standards that I hold all people. That’s splitting hairs too much and does a disservice to the characters and what they have established in the past 11 books or so. Violence is still violence. It was wrong and made me think that Eric is losing it. Not it mimd or grasp on reality, but the it that made him special and set apart. I don’t hold him to a higher stanard, he appears to have a higer standard. Thoughout the ENTIRE series we have seen countless examples of him doing the exact opposite of being violent. Now we get three doses of it.
Oddly, I didn’t have difficulty with Eric fighting at FT.
As you say Jerron, we seemed to have held him to a higher standard.
That’s what disappointed me about his 2 attacks on Pam and his brutal fanging (is that a word) of Sookie after the battle.
Well when you attack someone you love it’s not fighting for your life…around here we call that “abuse” So to see such a turn in character when nothing and I mean nothing in the last 11 books says that it is part of his character then I have a ‘WTF’ moment.
Sounds kinda like CH is leveling the playing field a bit. Sookie stands naked before Bill, the implication being she trusts him not to rape her. The further implication being the rape was no big deal because he was starved and tortued. It wasn’t Bill’s fault. Rape excused, justified, and dispensed with. Now she has Eric attacking Pam??? What. the. ever. loving. FUCK?
Yup…sums it up for me. Where the hell is she going with all that?
Wow, I just have no idea but it doesn’t sound good to me. It sounds like revisionist history. I would say some other things but I have no right since I haven’t read the books.
For someone who never read the books you have a firm grasp on the events…Well played Sunny! And you are right revisionist history is what is going on.
Thanks Jerron, I’m just going by this discussion. Thank you guys for being so honest in your appraisals.
She’s pandering to a fan base so that the sales of her books continue.
BG, I don’t get it. It makes no sense. Effectively, if she keeps this up, she’s trading the satisfaction of a majority of her fans to pander to the minority. I CANNOT BELIEVE SHE HAS ERIC ATTACKING PAM AND SOOKIE. If EL’s excuse this action they’re not better than BL’s, and that’s the truth.
Sunny that was one of my first comments! I am an EL and I couldn’t believe the attacks!
Dang Jerron. As we were discussing the other week, the rumors of Bill’s ‘redemption’ in this book sounded bad enough. Now the reality is even worse than I imagined.
Right Sunny!!! It was bad enough that she tried to “fix” Bill..but then she had to go and bring down Eric in the process! I know that the two are separate but could you ever see TB Eric choking Pam?
That’s what seems to be happening with EL’s. It kind of disappointed me. No one seems to see it so far and I ain’t going to point it out for various reasons.
That’s what seems to be happening with EL’s. It kind of disappointed me. No one seems to see it so far and I ain’t going to point it out for various reasons.
BG, this was the EXACT point I was making in my post about the AE clip. Even if I am proven wrong about the clip, the absolute HOSTILITY to questioning anything about Eric when it comes to something they WANT to believe was astounding. This is the exact thing they accuse BL’s of doing.
So true..AGAIN.
Lack of formal education and knowledge about literary and cinematic techniques leads me to question some of my own perceptions sometimes. It’s a relief to know I’m not a total dolt.
Of course you’re not a total dolt! Shit, I’ve no formal education in these areas either I just cram as much info into my head as possible and then rely on my own intuition. BG, your instincts are fine– better than fine. Trust yourself.
Thanks Sunny. Sometimes you need a little reinforcement.
Sometimes you need a little reinforcement.
Ain’t it the truth? I’m usually fine with my neck sticking out in public but it’s nice when good friends have my back. I can’t tell you how much I appreciate you, and all you guys, who stick up for me when I try to point out the elephants dancing around the room.
Yup. It’s tuff sometimes to go against the herd.
I’ll say it even if I’m totally wrong. She’s pandering to a fan base so that the sales of her books continue. I don’t know if I can blame her to a certain extent. This is her lively- hood. I’m sure she must have struggled for a lot more years than years of success.
You are right! She is pandering to the fan base. And as such she has opened herself up to more critism than she would have had otherwise.
I think that is the difference between someone who writes books and someone who is an author.
Sunny and BG I always have your backs! Even when we disagree (Let the Right One In) I still go back and look it over to see where you are coming from.
Thank you Jerron.
Oooo LTROI… still get shivers thinking about that movie. LOL
Hell, I could be wrong about that. I could be wrong about a lot of things and probably am. I just get my back up when people act HOSTILE when you challenge their pov. Tell me why you disagree and back it up! I love it! Debate is good for the soul.
@Bobsgran,
I get where you are coming from re: Eric’s behavior. I do think there is a difference between vamp on vamp violence and vamp on human violence. That doesn’t mean that I like that Eric was violent with Pam, especially when he should be able to just verbally command her to be silent and she’d have to obey him. I do have to point out, though, that Pam knows Eric likes the back of her own hand and she was pushing him repeatedly and she knew it. Again, that doesn’t excuse Eric’s behavior, but Pam knew that she was goading him.
Regarding Eric biting Sookie. I don’t personally characterize that as an “attack”. Sookie gave him permission to bite her; the way he did it, I think was wrong; Sookie doesn’t deserve to have physical pain inflicted on her by someone who says they love her. Eric was being a dick and he knew it. I think that if Sookie is going to remain in a relationship with Eric, she will have to lay down very clear nonnegotiable lines in the sand with him about what she will and will not put up with. I don’t think she should accept violence or physical pain in an intimate relationship. I really think that she needs to state this unequivocally so there is absolutely no confusion on that subject. Sookie and Eric have needed to talk about so many things for so long and something slways interrupts them, but they can’t go on like that.
I think that Sookie made some serious headway in this book in terms of establishing appropriate boundaries for herself with several people in her life. Notably, Amelia, Claude and Alcide. She also made clear to Bill that she was totally aware of his ongoing sexual interest in her no matter how she was clothed or unclothed and that she wasn’t going there with him.
I think she has to continue on this path with everbody else in her life, especially Eric and all of her fae relatives, particularly Niall.
Sookie can’t escape her involvement with the supernatural world even if she wanted to. I think CH is putting things in her path to force her to wake up to the full reality of the world she is dealing with and the rules of that world. Every group of supes she has dealt with are incredibly violent. They all pretty much have their own agengas where she is concerned as well. Sookie needs to understand this and find way to deal with it and protect herself the best way she can instead of continually expecting supernatural creatures to have human values. Again, that doesn’t mean she should put up with violence on her person from anybody, especially from her loved ones.
I hope that book 12 has a lot of conversation between Eric and Sookie. I hope he apologizes for treating her that way and I hope she tells him that she absolutely will not put up with that and if he ever does anything like that again, they are over for good. I also think that Eric needs to be really clear with Sookie and what he expects in the relationship and what is nonnegotiable for him. If they can’t accept each others nonnegotiables, then they need to call it quits.
I kind of get where you are coming from jaytea–kind of–at least insofar as the books. But I am quite, QUITE certain, beyond any shadow of any doubt whatsoever that TB Eric would never lay a violent hand on Pam. Biting Sookie and thoughtlessly causing her physical pain? OUT OF THE QUESTION. He stroked her head and felt TERRIBLE for having to bite her in the penultimate ep of s3. TB Eric sets his own boundaries. He doesn’t need to be told by anyone not to hurt the people he loves.
See Sunny I find this acceptance of what he did unacceptable. If we are to believe that Eric transcends his vampire nature, which we are told to believe to be one of the conditions for a relationship with Sookie then we can’t go back and say well he is a vampire. That doesn’t work for me. And it’s not enough to replace the damage toaster you broke.
I think this is CH watering down Eric to appease the BL.
Futhermore I will call a spade a spade and that shit was just plain wrong.
I think this is CH watering down Eric to appease the BL.
I think it’s WORSE than that. What I’ve heard in this discussion makes me believe that CH has deliberately taken AB’s characterization of Bill and superimposed it over Book Eric. TB BILL is the one who is constantly shown abusing/hurting the women around him–his progeny, Sookie, his maker.. basically every woman he comes into contact with he attacks in some way.
WHY AREN’T EL’S UP IN ARMS ABOUT THIS? I don’t even read the fucking books and I’m seeing red.
I guess it’s because Sookie was being a hypocrit.
Or maybe that’s CH’s point. When we like someone we will bend rules to make the character likeable to us.
Or maybe that’s CH’s point. When we like someone we will bend rules to make the character likeable to us
Maybe this IS her point, but her snide remarks about TB make me think her intentions are somewhat less noble. I hope I’m wrong.
see the end result IMO about CH portraying Eric in DR was simple.. Sookie has an easy choice to make.. so if she ends up with Eric in book 13 she made her choice.. if she doesnt then so be it..
Eric isnt going to change anymore then he has been throughout the books.. what excatly is Sookie looking for??
who said Eric was different then Billy??
Eric in the earlier books also refered to himself as being a vampire.. even in DTTW when he had amnesia.. & in DTTW when he had that talk with Sookie by the fireplace & they talked about the Antelpoe & the Lion..
Eric has never tried to be anything different to Sookie which is why it took her so long to actually hook up with him.. he has never tried to hide his vampire nature from Sookie in any of the books.. in fact he showed it to her more often then not.. ” Bowling for vampire’s in DD.. Eric loves a great battle & Sookie knows that as well.. she mentions it all the time in all the books how Eric loves a battle..
It wasn’t a battle to save lives it was a knock down drag out with his child. He lost control for whatever reason and took out his frustrations on soomeone weaker.
I think what I’m taking from this is that maybe CH has not been entirely true to the character she originally put in print. I see it as changing the rules part way through the game. I will be totally pleased to be proven wrong.
i thgought it was pretty clear why Eric choked Pam in the car scene & fought in Sookie house with Pam as well.. Pam was about to tell Sookie info that he didnt want told ..
so they fought like they were in the streets.. Pam can hold her own as well since she got some good licks in.. i guess Eric didnt want to hurt her because he could of..
I agree sunny, I don’t think TB Eric would behave that way with either Pam or Sookie.
I admit that I wish CH hadn’t gone there with book Eric either, but she did, so I’m just trying to sort out how Sookie might stay in a reltionship with him that is a good relationship for her to be in. It’s incredibly hard for me to picture Sookie settling for book Sam, but at this point it really seems like it’s either Eric or Sam or nobody and apparently CH has said that Sookie will not end up alone. (Although, she could just be being twisty and maybe Sookie will end up raising Hunter which would technically make her not alone…idk)
I also sometimes think that CH was somehow blindsided by fans love for Eric’s character. How she would be surprised by this, I don’t know, but I just get the impression that she has felt boxed in by the intense Bill love on the one hand and the intense Eric love on the other and maybe this was her way of trying to even things out. I mean she has definitely said that Eric (book Eric) is dangerous and that she doesn’t understand why fans love him so much!!! Meanwhile, she is writing about supernatural characters who are all incredibly violent with each other!
That’s much the same observation I’ve had. Her protagonist was hijacked by fandom.
Excatly Jayetta,
i think folks who read the books way before TB came along see Eric different anyway then TB Eric..
Eric in DUD Sookie described him as bueatyfull but Cold.. sge used the words glacier or whatever.. there are other times throughout the earlier books when Sookie states Eric scares her ( before the BB was fully created).. so DR to me is not a shock.. Eric scared her when he chocked Pam in the car.. Eric bit her in the Fangtasia scene.. in DD Sookie notes Eric’s temper & she notes his temper in other early books.. DAG being the most recent..
why is everuone so shocked??
Because his anger and physical abuse was directed the 2 people he says he trusts the most.
Because his anger and physical abuse was directed the 2 people he says he trusts the most.
Who are also women..TB Bill is the woman hater who doesn’t hesitate to get violent with females. This is not the Eric I’ve come to know, at least not the TB version. I think CH has betrayed her own character because I’ve never heard anything from readers that led me to believe Eric was capable of doing this to the women who love and depend on him. How can they trust him after this? How can readers? It seems like the trust in the character has been deliberately destroyed. IMO.
Yup.
can’t argue with that. There is something more going on here and I don’t see how people can excuse this.
IDK Sunny,
so far all the men who are Sookie’s suiter’s in the books have hit or killed or done something to a women..
during the werewolf war Sam & Alcide killed women.. Eric fights with Pam, Bill rapes women, Niall whores his granddaughter out in the short story gift wrap by sending Preston.. & Sookie sleeps with him.. WQuinn sell’s Sookie out to Felipe & Victor ( The NV vamps)..
i think CH felt that it was time for Eric fans to have a reality check.. i think CH felt that it was time for Eric to do something..
it doesnt matter that Pam is a vampire, because he is her Maker, just as his Maker pimped him out to Oklahoma.. Sookie is his wife & she goes by the title but doesnt really act like his wife.. Pam brought that up in the scene before Eric attacked her.. Pam said ” what kinda husband are you, your wife sleeps with other men, goes shopping with other men, & lives with other men”..LOL @ Pam.. i guess that provoked Eric & that was the last straw as far as he was concerned.. besides the fact that Pam wanted to Tell Sookie about Oklahoma..
i guess the moral of the story is that people who you trust & love can hurt you ??
Sookie / Gran & Family dynamics.. Eric & Pam/ Appuis & Alexie = Family dynamics..
IDK, how this bite scene is anymore trama then the one Sookie said hurt in DAAD on her wrist.. Sookie said that bite hurt as well & Eric wasent being pleasent.. so that is physical abuse.. & she offered her wrist in DAAD just like she offered her neck in DR.. i guess the Urgency of him healing in DAAD could be an excuse.. Eric was still kinda fond of Sookie in that book.. so now he bites her & all hell breaks loose in DR.. because Sookie said it hurt..
i honestly think that this isnt the first time Eric & Pam has fought.. but it is the first time Sookie witnesses it..
Pam told Sookie way back in DD that she was lucky that Eric treats her well enough because he was fond of Sookie..**snort**
at the end of the day it boils down to Sookie… if she doesnt like it dump him.. Sookie is use to dumping people in the books.. if she feels that she is going through a repeat version of Billy then that would be my advice to Sookie..
i guess the moral of the story is that people who you trust & love can hurt you ??
Of course they can. The peole you love can hurt you MORE than anyone else. However, there has to be some level of trust or you shouldn’t even be around them. I know my husband, for instance, is capable of doing things that will hurt me even if he doesn’t mean to. He’s human, and we have to allow for mistakes. HOWEVER, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt he would never lay a violent hand on me under any circumstances I could imagine. He hasn’t in nearly 29 years of marriage and he’s not going to suddenly START beating the shit out of me, now or ever.
Right & Sookie in DR NEVER said She doesnt trust Eric.. that was never the issue.. even after he bit her.. she didnt say at the end she doesnt trust Eric..
what Sookie was questioning actually after all of those events that she saw in DR at the end was Eric having excitment after killing Victor.. in the car ride home with Billy her not trusting Eric was never mentioned.. she didnt like the fact that he enjoyed the fight at Fangtasia.. she didnt even get mad at the bit scene.. but she thought it to us which is how we know it hurt.. same as she has done in the passed when the bites hurt..
IATM it’s context. When he bit her wrist, there was another vampire at the widow, he had thrown a rock at Eric and was holding a hostage. Determined to do everyone harm.
When Eric bit her at FT the fight was over, they had won. Context.
Excatly, that was why i said above that i guess the Urgency of the bite in DAAD could be the excuse… but Sookie still said it hurt & he wasent pleasent.. vs. when Eric bit her in ATD in front of Andre & Sookie still said the bite hurt but Eric was trying to make it pleasent as possible.. ( that would be the rubbing of her back he did during that bite trying to make it as pleasent as possible)..
like i said before Sookie complains about the bites unless she is active in sexual intercourse.. in fact Sookie states that in ATD actually.. she doesnt consider the bites hurtfull during sex.. but any time otherwise they hurt..
like for example : in DITF when Eric was injured by Alexie Sookie didnt offer him her blood & yet Jason offered Pam his half Fae/ were panther blood to heal.. Sookie gave Eric a bottle of TB.. & then they drove to battle to kill Alexie.. luckly Eric feed on Colmen to heal all the way.. Sookie knows that Human blood heals the vamps faster then TB..
so in DR Sookie offer’s her blood to Eric after the battle of the fight at Fangtasia & he doesnt try to sugar coat the bite.. & Sookie let’s us know that Eric isnt trying to be pleasent.. in DTTW Eric was injured for taking the bullet for Sookie & Sookie declined offering him her blood & she gave him a bottle of TB..
speaking of DAAD & Salmone ( Maker/ Female) & Mickey ( Progeny/ Male).. Salome had to decipline Mickey for going into Eric’s territory when he called her for Sookie in that scene.. Lorena ( Maker) & Bill’s ( Progeny) Torture scene..
i personally think CH droped all the clues as to how Vampire’s deal with their progeny’s from time to time.. Appuis & Eric & Appuis & Alxeie..
i mean i really wonder how many times off script Eric had to put hands on Pams?? i’m sure maybe when she was younger?? besides in the scene in DR when they all ( Eric/ Pam/ Sookie) went to Victor’s bar & they found out Pam got ruffed up by Victor’s people one of the first things Eric said to Victor was that was agianst the law & should be left for the Maker to do & he was peeved that someone else put hands on Pam..
so apperantly it’s more common then we have read this far in the books.. that is the way it looks to me..
I think the fan love is a mixture of SVM Eric, TB Eric and Alexander.
Also this about face is indication that CH is in it for the money meaning she writes books for a living. In the beginning I honestly believe she wrote because she loved it but the game has changed as the checks have added zeros and commas.
I am not calling her a great artist but she does have a voice so she should remain true. What if someone told daVinci to use a prettier model? Would the painting be so compelling? Told Shakespeare not to kill Romeo and Juliet…would we still read that play?
Ahh yes those zeros are a great motivator.
Hi jayetea! For some reason this post was hung up in the file to be moderated. Sorry about that.
Looks like y’all are having a great conversation. I’m a little over half way finished with the book, so I probably won’t be joining in for a couple more days.
i personally think Eric bit her like that because he had enough of her being such a hyprocrite & talking shit.. he wasent on purpose trying to be gental.. he wanted her to feel his fangs.. she went & broke the BB..
basically this is it.. she can either move on or take the good with the bad type of situation..
Eric is a vampire.. & she did offer the blood to him in that scene after talking shit about her own plan to kill Victor..
So she deserved it? She had it coming to her? See this is why you can’t go down this path as an excuse for Eric.
Yes, Sookie did deserve it.. that is what she get’s.. just like her & Amelia breaking the BB & now that makes her vulnerable to Felipe now.. Sookie is up for grabs..
CH was kind to Sookie in both DITF & DR since Sookie escaped both books without injury.. lets see how long that last with all the foreshadowing from DR..
Wow
This is Sookie’s story not Eric’s.. even though i love the Eric character Sookie will always have the ball in her court because she is the protagonist in the story..
the books are mystery books.. Sookie didnt have to offer her blood to Eric just because other humans were.. i thought Sookie was an independant women?? i thought Sookie makes her own mind up??
Eric is his own man as well… if he bites hard to her then she should dump his ass.
Yeah see, I don’t agree with this at all, and I won’t ever agree with this line of reasoning. This is the same shit BL’s spew.
As EL’s are fond of saying, these are CH’s characters and she can do with them what she will. That doesn’t mean everyone has to like it or keep quiet about it.
No what i meant…. is that in DR Sookie see’s a side of Eric that she doesnt like.. so why is she continuing the relationship going into book 12??
i would like a logical reason for that.. if she didnt like the fact that he fights with with vampire child Pam who she consideres her best vampire friend.. then move on.. if she didnt like the fact that he bit her hard/ or harsh then move on.. she has already been down this road before..
i use to say that Sookie never learns from her past book mistakes.. it doesnt seem like she learned that much in DR either.. her options are so simple in DR.. besides the fact that Eric is bethrolled to another women on top of it..
that is what i mean when i said this si Sookie’s story.. she is the protagonist..
That’s what I meant when I said you can’t go down that road because if you do you have to excuse/forgive everything from that point onward.
I don’t mind if Eric does something bad for the greater good. But the violent he deplayed was not for the greater good.
i wasent making excuses up.,. the excuses were provided to us in DR.. by other character’s.. Immanuel the hairdresser & everyone else..
according to Imannuel if Eric would have ordered Pam to stop fighting that was considered wrong & disrespectfull in the vampire world.. not human world.. or rather vampire culture.. according to Sookie when she asked Eric if they are better now ( E/P) Eric say’s Pam is one of your dear friends or something to that effect.. maybe he said Pam really likes her or something.. i’m not quoting right because the book is still new in my head..
Basically the excuses were given to us in DR like after Billy raped Sookie in CD Sookie started making excuses for Bill to other character’s in DAAD.. she did that with Alcide & everyone else..
A verbal snark maybe. But physical pain…I don’ think so.
Very nicely put Jayetea. However, the issue was Eric’s treatment of Pam ( the choking & beating) and the excuses I see that are being made. Regardless of the the fact that it is vamp on vamp. Neither were in a life or death situation. I cannot condone beating up a woman. Eric is older and much stronger than Pam. That is the thing I take issue with and quite frankly the excuses made by some sound just like excuses made by Bill Lovers who excuse his behaviour, under the guise of vamp politics. Then take issue with BL’s reasonings. I am not pointing fingers, simply stating my perception.
The bottom line for me, Eric has been written almost suddenly as brutal to those he loves. I find that disconcerting.
it doesnt make it right in any fashion.. but why is Sookie even going into book 12 still dating Eric after she already witnessed it?? why is Sookie going to Billy’s house naked in his hidey hole after he already raped her??
why is Sookie even still trying to date vampire’s after she has already been complaining about the bites hurt since IDK, DUD?? she complained about it hurting in DAAD when Eric bit her to heal to fight Mickey, she complained about the bites hurting in ATD when Eric bit her in front of Andre… so this isnt new to Sookie Stakhouse.. & Frankly the only time Sookie didnt complian about the bite’s from vampire’s was when she was having sex.. & Eric in both DTTW & DAG bit her during sex..
I believe she said the pain depended on the vampire…if the vamp wanted it to be painless then it would be.
Excatly,
that is why i said Eric did that on purpose.. he didnt want it to be a gental thing.. that doesnt make it right but he had his reasons.. & frankly if Sookie doesnt like it she can end the relationship.. her options are so simple in DR..
The bottom line for me, Eric has been written almost suddenly as brutal to those he loves. I find that disconcerting
*Nodding head in approval* That’s what I have been trying to say.
I understand what you are saying, Bobsgran. I do think there are some double standards being applied. I don’t condone Eric’s behavior either. It is disconcerting and I think CH wants it to be…
Another 3 things…didn’t there seem to be an awful lot of stuff that happened off page that you would have liked to read? Like that book could have been another 100 pages and still been good because I wanted better accounts of what went on.
Somebody, anybody, everybody please tell CH that people of color are no longer being referred to as Negroes. She should know better.
Was it me or did it seem like CH went to extra efforts to me Bookie more strong, diametrically opposed to TB Sookie? I’ve said it before and I will say it again…CH doesn’t really like that show.
Jerron. I don’t really know if CH likes TB or not. I do think TB has taken on a life of it’s own apart from the books. As for Sookie being different, she is in a far different place in the books than on TB. I hope to see TB Sookie gain some strength this season because I can’t stand her right now.
This is something I have pieced together from differenct interviews and such. She has said things like some of the characters on the show are not the characters in the books. She knows the real story. blah blah blah… Just a theory of mine.
Yeah, Jerron and I had this discussion the other week. She said something pretty snide about TB in an interview and it wasn’t the first time I’ve heard her say something similar.
A lot of people call TB AB’s ‘Fan fiction’ version of the SVM, but fanfic writers don’t get CH’s signature on the dotted line and pay her a truck load of money for the privilege.
Maybe that’s what has gotten me thinking she should have wrapped it up by now. Do you think TB has eclipsed the author?
I doubt it has in the eyes of a lot of fans but if CH keeps taking Eric down this rabbit hole they may change their minds.
I’ll be frank with you right now and say that I’m glad I never invested my time and heart in this series. This installmant sounds like a total WTF and I would be mad and upset at the developments I’m hearing about. Alan Ball PAID CH to use these characters and he has as much right to them as she does. If she didn’t like the idea then she should have kept them to herself.
I feel so out in the field with my feelings about this book. My gush does not runneth over. Sort of makes you gun shy YKWIM. Yes some questions were answered but some of the character development bothered me.
I tell what is bohtering me the most about this book. Sookie is not allowed to live her own life. People keep pulling the strings and making her turn. Even for the sake of good, she is still being controlled. Bugs me. And one other thing…FINISH A CONVERSTATION! Really putting things off doesn’t make them go away. God I wanted to throw the book across the room. Let me stop…that makes me so mad.
Without a doubt! I mean there is a difference in the quality of storytelling. AB has totally fleshed out the characters and in such limited time have given new life. One of the best things he did was take the show out of 1st person narrative. You have a more global picture of Bon Temps. LaLa, and Jessica also add so much to the show.
This is a little aside but it brings the point home. I was watching Shark Tank for some reason. This guy had this great invention and it was a winner for sure. One of the investors told him, “You have a great product and it is going to be a sucess. But you need to get out of the way and let me handle it from here” And he was so right! You could tell that guy had no clue as to what to do from there.
That’s what AB did to SVM.
I have been saying for a long time that the books should have ended at 10. Nice even number and it keeps the storylines from repeating. I think the show should end at 5 seasons. Same reason.
I firmly believe the show WILL end at five seasons. Get out while your still at the top of your game is a showbiz mantra CH should have taken to heart.
I mean there is a difference in the quality of storytelling.
Just going by excerpts I’ve read, I’ve known this all along. Not only has AB added layers and subtext CH apparently hasn’t, he’s taken the basic storyline and better fulfilled it’s dramatic potential. AND he’s had the courage she apparently lacks to explode her numerous ‘bombs in the garden’ in a highly satisfactory way.
Exactly and some of the best shows on television end at 5 maybe 6.
Just going by excerpts I’ve read, I’ve known this all along. Not only has AB added layers and subtext CH apparently hasn’t, he’s taken the basic storyline and better fulfilled it’s dramatic potential. AND he’s had the courage she apparently lacks to explode her numerous ‘bombs in the garden’ in a highly satisfactory way.
Right on again…like I said before there is a difference between a person who writes stories and an author!
I’ve noticed that for me the bar has been set really high by AB in adapting one medium to another. I going by my reaction to Game of Thrones.
There is nothing new in the series. It’s almost verbatim from the books so far. Meh. I’ve been spoiled by AB.
My bar was set by the Wire! I had NEVER seen a show that did not waste one word of dialogue. Tb is pretty close in that regard.
I’ve never seen The Wire. Should I rent it?
EL’s and BL’s alike claim they don’t want a verbatim adaptation–until it comes to some cherished bit concerning their favored character.
BG I would absolutely recommend you rent the Wire..but I will say that it is not for everyone…lots of cussing and it is slow moving but once you finish you will never see tv the same.
@bobsgran – you should absolutely rent The Wire. There are 5 seasons. It’s by far the best written tv show I’ve ever watched. Plus, Chris Bauer is in it -S2.
How would you know, you never read her books? How would you know about the bomb?
@Jerron,
Word. I flinched a bit when I read the Negroes line… the only explanation I could think of was that Dermot as a character was not up to date on the appropriate terminology, but I did find it odd and I’m surprised the editors left it in.
I’m pretty sure that that would be the explanation for it but he also used current terminology and was proud he used the right words.
I think it wasn’t necessary and could have gone without.
Isn’t there some suggestion in DR–I can’t recall if it’s in this discussion or elsewhere—that Eric conspired with Niall, or somebody, in some nefarious plot involving Sookie? I may be WAY off base here..
I have to read that part again to understand fully. I didn’t see it so much of a conspiracy as Eric wanting to have some sort of protection for Sookie.
Crap…should have added that the protection turned out to be Claudine.
This, at least, is good to know.
I wonder how Renee is feeling about all this? Isn’t it about time she weighed in??
Yeah you are correct Eric did spy on her but it was for protection but yet again we are presented with movements around her but not including her.
So what your saying is that, basically, CH has equated Eric and Bill in the ‘stalker’ sense. See? Eric is no better than Bill.
Yes, but it wasn’t mentioned in any of the books till now. Again revisionist history in the guise of a bomb in the garden. That’s what is bothering me. It doesn’t track for some reason. There was NO indication till DR.
Anyone who read the books knew that Eric was getting his information and he had spies watching Sookie. I knew that all long.
The reason Claudine show up because Eric was worried about Sookie and knew she was in danger. Bill is stalking Sookie and Eric is having someone watching her and if she is danger that person will protect her.
And if we as readers are to find out some other things about him that are Bill like in future books, I call foul. There has been NO hint up to now. Others may call this a bomb in the garden, but I’m not so sure.
So, again, she has NO problem setting off Eric bombs in the garden she never even planted, but is too cowardly to set off the Bill bombs she actually DID plant.
If you replaced “Bill” with “Eric”
you would have had book 3 all over again.
Jerron could you connect those dots for me. It’s been a long time since I’ve read CD.
By this I mean she was having relationship problems and talking them over with Bill as in CD she talked them over Eric. She had the rough sex with Eric as she did Bill in CD. Bill drove her home as Eric did in CD.
I’d have to re-read the entire series to be certain of that. I could have missed a “bomb” most certainly. It may have been very obscure.
Bill’s smelling like a fricken rose right now, baring one incident. That being he tells Sookie he doesn’t love Judith who saved him from silver poisoning and they’ve been “together”. She was listening in the woods and he knew she was there.
And the monkey sex scene was the same as the after football game sex.
And the monkey sex scene was the same as the after football game sex
Wait, what? I don’t get this. I know Bill kinda forced rough sex on Sookie after the football game..right? Do you mean Eric did the same in DR?
that wasent like the football sex in LDID IMO..
since Sookie agreed to break the BB at the time E/S have sex on the porch Sookie was asking for it harder & harder.. i guess the sex is different now since the BB is broke..**snort**
BTW, Judith a sibling of Bill, made by Lorena was supposed to be a dead ringer for his wife Caroline.
And with the choke-a-bitch scene made him a brute.
Did that whole episode, the choke hold and the fight in the kitchen with Pam remind you of the Bill punching out Lorena at RE’s mansion?
That was the first thing I thought after I read that.
Jeebus H…
I was too much in the WTF moment to compare at the time. But can you see TB Eric who is nothing but gentle with his child. Who walked into the hornet’s nest to save her, choking Pam????
This is the same man/vamp who begged Sookie not to cry.
Chile please! This is nothing but revisionist.
we saw Eric in DAG “pounding Sookie as she describe it in sex”..
on TB we saw Eric pounding Yvetta in sex..
Not the same to me, because he didn’t have a relationship with Yvetta.
There’s pounding and then there is pounding. She didn’t need an ice-pack before.
in DAG Sookie had the BB that connected her to Eric & in the sex scene in DAG Sookie said :
” He was so deep inside me as he could get without an Operation” Chapter 10 DAG ( page 171)..
in DR chaper 9 (page 183) porch sex scene :
Sookie say’s :
“Go Hard” , “Go,Go,Go”
Eric say’s ” Is this hard enough”?
Sookie was asking for the pounding she got in DAG.. i dont see why everyone is tripping about the ice pack.. it’s not like Sookie is on “V” like Bill healed her virgina in DUD after sex.. Eric in DR gave her an Ice pack.. & that seemed like something he does often as well since afterwards Sookie notes that after orgasm Eric went & got her an ice pack to place in her “yahoo palace”..
HAHA there is two sex scene’s in DAG actually in the same chapter.. Sookie notes :
” i thought i would be pounded into pieces” same sex scene i mentioned already..
the other sex scene in DAG is on page starts on (page 172) same chapter ( 10)
& Sookie was riding the G.P. & she states ” i rose & fell faster & faster & this time she bite Eric’s wrist & he yelled in an incoherent sound of release..
I don’t recall her needing an ice-pack in any of those scenes.
Rememeber Sookie saying in DTTW that she “walked sideways” after having sex with Eric & she was sore ( but it was a “good sore”).. that was DTTW i can find the page for you if you like??
in DAG Sookie talks about being a good sore the next day after sex with Eric in DAG..
Eric has a big cock.. CH made that very clear in all the sex scene’s in the books between E/S.. even in DITF when Sookie sucked his cock “nursed it” she talks about it being big..
Thanks to all these reminders of the great GP I’m going to have to step outside for a breath of fresh air or the laundry isn’t going to get done. *fans self over and over*
here is what Sookie said in DTTW page 127 chapter 7
“i woke. in a mindless pool of contentment. i was sore, but plseantly so”… she states she feels good & relaxed & ect..ect..
now compare that to DR : chapter 9 page 184 Sookie says :
” It was Magnificant, it was exhausting, & it was excellent, we stayed on the swing for 30 minutes, recovering, cooling off & holding eachother.. i was Happy & relaxed i didnt want to move, but of course i needed to go inside & clean myself up & put some clothes on”..
Sookie continues on saying :
” while i arranged myself, he ( Eric) heated up some blood & fixed an ice pack & a glass of ice tea for me, he applied the ice pack himself while i lay on the couch”…
and Compare that to DAG
DAG chapter 11 ( page 185) after E/S sex scene Sookie states :
” when i got up the next day at noon, feeling as relaxed as a cat in a pool of sunshine”..
Nothing has changed in all the books in the sex department between E/S..
Two different folks explained some past events ..
Claude explained to Sookie how far back Eric & Niall really go.. which is why Niall was talking about Eric when he made the statement ” The Vampire loves you” in DAG.. so the Billy fans can drop that bull shit IMO..
Eric told Niall that Sookie was in Danger way back at least in CD ( they were doing business togather).. Niall basically didnt tell Eric that Sookie was his half Fae granddaughter.. because Sookie told Eric that in DD ( book 6) that she had Fae blood in her.. Eric’s response in DD was ” That explains it”.. he was talking about Niall’s interest in Sookie way before Eric introduced Sookie to Niall in FDTW book 8.. Niall told Sookie in FDTW that Eric wanted to know what he wants with her before he does a face to face with her in person..
from what Claude said or explained it to Sookie Niall was already keeping a watchfull eye on Sookie when she was a baby & when Fintin was still alive.. after Fintin died then he used Eric to keep that eye on Sookie.. Sookie didnt even know this was going on all she knew was that she met Claudine in CD.. Claude told Sookie in DR that Niall felt Sookie was “withering” so that is why he sent Claudine.. Sookie was dating Billy Boy way back then when she was withering…
then Later Terry explains that he was Erics spy & he got something out of it as well.. so everyone benifits.. the Terry stuff was going on by at least book 6 when Sookie was dating Quinn..
Me either BG!
Yoohoo Renee. Desperately seeking Renee’s opinion.
Not forced but rough enough for her to need an ice pack and having to replace torn clothes.
Eric is the holder of the G.P. & that doesnt change.. so we already know he has a big Cock.. his cock didnt strink size just because Sookie needed an ice pack in DR.. Sookie walked sideways after sex with Eric in DTTW.. Sookie mentioned she “nursed” the G.P. in DITF.. Sookie talked about being sore in DAG after sex with Eric but she always makes it sound like it’s a good sore not a bad sore..
it’s so wild to me how people have interpreted some of the scene’s..
Claude told Sookie that Niall & Eric were dealing business & Eric told Niall Sookie was in danger so Niall sent Claudine ( book 3) since claudine doesnt enter the books till CD.. to Bon Temps to watch over Sookie.. then the Terry stuff was around book 6 ..
the porch sex scene was the next day that Amelia & Sookie broke the BB.. Sookie was asking for it harder & harder ..Eric said “is that hard enough for you”?? LOL !! then he got her an ice pack to place on what Sookie calls her virgina ” her yahoo palace”..
She needed an ice pack…how much rougher can you get.
Sookie asked for it harder & harder… so of course she will need an ice pack.. she isnt ingesting vampire blood to heal.. Sookie hasent ingested vamp blood since DAG..
I wish TB Sookie would get off the junk.
i think she will depending on how AB does the story..
we found out in DR that Billy Boy once had a BB human that didnt end well he said.. Go Figure. i wonder if he made his human BB a renfield??
lmao!! I could type something so obnoxious here….
Hey Osterby,
can you imagine Billy Boys BB human?? he or she just had to be a renfiled… LOL !!
But she asked, no told Eric to go harder. I thought she was looking to “feel more” since she had broken the bond and could no longer feel what Eric was feeling.
Right Krtmd,
Eric was trying to make sure Sookie was pleased sexually in what she wanted or likes..
i mean c’mon this is Sookie Graveyard sex Sookie.. in DTTW Sookie said her & AE had sex all over the house in all positions.. they did 69 position they screwed on the table in DTTW & in DR they had monkey sex on the swing..
I think they were both trying to feel “the depth” of what they had always felt. Confirming the feelings the have for each other.
I agree with that as well Osterby,
i mean this sex scene before it even started Eric asked Sookie if she still loves him ( since the BB was broke) & she said yes..
i think both of them were aiming for what they felt before the breakage of the BB.. it seems like they didnt loose any depth since Sookie said the same thing she always say’s after sex with Eric.. so nothing changed ..
it would have been different if they had sex & Sookie told the reader’s that she felt nothing & the love or spark of their union wasent there..or something clever Sookie could have said to tell us that she wasent pleased ..
the difference like what Sookie stated in LDID after the football sex with Billy.. that is why i dont look at the scene’s the same way.. besides Sookie & Bill did it doggy style in her living but he was waiting for her on her porch after she droped off JB..
So many parallels. They just sort of hit you over the head, don’t they?
HAHA yup Osterby,
like for examble in DR : Sookie gives us a description of what Bill was wearing ( he was in a Tank Top & jeans).. that is new as far as we know for Billy’s dress code..
so CH wrote Bill dressing like Eric in DR from Sookie’s perspective..
Sookie didnt even talk about Eric’s clothes or what he was wearing at all in DR.. so i assume he was wearing pretty much what he always wears Tank Top or Fangtashia top & jeans.. Sookie didnt even talk about what Pam was wearing.. & Sookie in the earlier books always thinks that Pam looks like Alice in Wonder Land..
She did have an Alice comment though…in the kitchen after her shower, pre-fight….Emmanual had been combing Pam’s hair hand she had a headband on…
also like another poster already posted down below..
Sookie took off Sam’s halo in DAG/ DITF & DR.. so she doesnt look at Sam as a angel anylonger ..
but actually the last time i remember Sookie describing Sam with his Halo Hair was way back in DTTW i think?? was there a time after that book?? i dont recall her saying it in DAAD?? so it has been a while since Sookie used the Halo for Sam in a descriptive sense..
Bill being in a tank top is saying like he is slummy it since Billy was always a stiff dresser.. Eric has always dressed casual unless something was going on like the Orgy party in LDID , or the Blue suit in Jackson in CD & the nice strip suit in LDID at the Hotel when Sookie arrived with Luna from the van.. but other then that Eric is always in a T-shirt or tank top & jeans..
Sookie did say in DR before they left to go to Victor’s she put on a dress Eric bought her & he got dressed up too.. but that was pretty much all the drescription of clothes she gave about herself & Eric in DR.. notice in DR when Sookie told us she was going to work she didnt describe the outfit ..like she use to do all the time in the earlier books..
The QSA/Hadly/RE – Eric/Sookie/QofO…we know how that turned out…
what do you mean Osterby?? not sure i understand..
are you comparing QSA/Hadley/ Peter/ Andre in a sense ??
E/S/Oklahoma ??
Russell is still alive in the books & married to King of Indiana (Bart)..
Sam told Sookie in DR that after he meet her grandfather ( Niall) way back in FDTW he started looking up Fae stuff in the Shifter database/ Liberay.. Sam also thinks that Sookie should hook up with Dermott he suggested.. & Sookie thought that was nasty.. eeeww he is her Uncle.. & Sam responded ” The Fae look or think things different” or he said something corny to that effect..
I’m beginning to wonder if CH is pissed that fandom both TV and print seems more concerned with the 2 main male vamps, than what happens to Sookie. The few sites that I’ve visited seem to have to bring posters back to the fact that it’s her story. CH’s site included.
Hence the Sunny/Jerron theory that she doesn’t like the show.
Then she should have retained creative control.
Almost no one likes TB Sookie, but I’ve heard complaints about Book Sookie as well. Most fans have different criticisms about the two, but some are similar like for instance both iterations of the character often seem obtuse or in stubborn denial.
Excatly Book Sookie is a total hyprocrite & she is on TB as well.. Book Sookie has been childish & in denile for so many books.. her growth is so limited at best.. i have never been a known Sookie lover on either book or show.. i make fun of book Sookie more though.. i think CH really brought out Sookie’s hyprocritcal personaility in DR moreso then she ever did in the other books..
IMO, Pam in ATD called Eric Master & got on her knee’s.. Eric was pissed off at Pam in CD when she wanted to tell Sookie about Bill & Lorena..
so in DR we Eric fans got a Pam & Eric fight scene.. i wouldnt be suprised if this wasent the first time they have fought.. this is the first time Sookie witnesses it because she is more activly involved in their business..
Like i said yesterday, if Eric wanted & it was pointed out by Immanuel Miriams brother that Eric could have ordered Pam to stop fighting & that would have been considered “controlling” the situation.. Imanuell also brought up some other points in that scene..
& another thing that bothered me in DR was this :
& i understand Sookie is the protagonist.. but C’mon did she really have to be there?? she went with Eric to Victor’s bar because she was invited by Victor.. how weird would it have really been if Sookie wasent at the bar when the kill was taking place?? what ever time Victor is around it’s important that Sookie is too otherwise Victor thinks something is fishy?? give me a break…
in DR we found out that alot of off page stuff was going on.. so why was it really neccassary that Sookie be at Fangtasia in the first place?? ooh more excuses were given to us that Victor would think it was wierd if she wasent there… REALLY?? every time Victor comes around or Felipe Sookie must be avalble or they think something is up?? Sookie could have said she didnt want to be there.. Sookie has said she didnt want to be somewhere before in the past books..
p289;
“Of course, Eric hadn’t wanted me to be there. He’d made it plain that a frail human should not be around when vampires were fighting. In theory, I agreed. I would much rather have been at home– but I would have worried every second. The clincher in my argument …” So it was Sookie that argued she had to be there, Eric who wished she didn’t. In fact, Eric repeats this p284 “I wish you didn’t have to be here.”
This just confirms my point above.. Sookie is the one who wanted to there as well..Eric perfered she stayed away..
i think CH created a Supe “Moral Code” world in the books that they all live by :
Kill or be Killed.. The Fae IMO all are creepy ( they have their own agenda) , The Vamps ( have their own agenda) , the were animals ( have their own agenda)..
& in the middle is this women Sookie… she is related to the creepy Fae..she is the granddaughter of the Fae Royaly & even Claude & Dermot said they are afraid of Niall.. but they love him.. yada,yada,yada..
Sam in DR thinks that it’s a good idea for Sookie to date a Fae relative.. this sounds like he is all for incest.. & this reminds me of DAAD Sam when he thought Calvin would be a respectable mate for Sookie.. Sam always favored Alcide over Quinn as well in the past.. & Sam was never to keen with Sookie dating vampire’s.. but he doesnt mind asking for favor’s from Eric..
Bill & Judith are finished.. but not before Bill knocked the boots & then he dumped her.. so i hope CH is not going to do another mad ex who stalks Sookie & tries to kill her.. Selah didnt do that & it appears that Judith got the message as well.. so i dont think she will be after Sookie trying to kill her because Bill dumped her..
The Compaion Book wedding was talked about in past tense.. so Sookie & Sam already attended the wedding in DR.. plus his family thought they were an item.. like we didnt see that comming in DITF when Sam asked Sookie to go with him instead of Jannalyn.. plus the color purple was brought up agian in DR when Sam was shopping for earrings for Jannalyn.. the color purple was first introduced to us in DITF & the color meant “deep misery”… so Sam in DR was in missery when he bought Jannayln her gift it appears.. or maybe because he loves Sookie?? which ever reason the color was brought up agian in DR..
Continue :
( hint to why AB uses color on TB & yes the Lavender dress color in s2 & s3 still meant something symbolically).. there were more color’s in DITF that were explained to us :
Fairness is blue. Adoration is crimson. Green is the color of betrayel. Yellow I think is doubt.
this is all explained in DITF in the scene where Sookie acted as shaman for the Pack.
Anyway i think Niall’s agenda regarding Preston was to knock Sookie up way back in Gift Wrap… Sookie didnt wear a condem with him, like she told the reader’s she did with Quinn..
Niall is comming back in one of the future books.. since his name was brought up so much in DR.. i think Claude & Dermott will be perparing for a future battle that is also comming & Niall will most likely participate in this like he did with the Fae battle..
i think Sookie has alot to think about concerning her future & that was all DR was really about.. if she chooses to have kids then she already knows that it’s highly likely her kids could get the Fae spark.. same as Jason & Hunter’s kids actually.. no matter if Sookie ends up with a were animal at the end or not.. if she ends up with a vampire then she can always do Artificial insemination since she brought that up in DITF.. but Sookie having kids at the end looks grimm IMO.. maybe she will just be around kids at the end since everyone is having babies in Bon Temps?? LOL !!
i thought Sam & Sookie’s conversation about Bob the cat having kittens & Sam telling her when he is Dean he isnt out there making puppies was funny..
CH has stated in interviews that a human would have to be a compltete idiot to get anywhere near vampires. So she created a protaganist that has another reason to get involved with them. She has also stated that Eric is not a good guy.
The supernatural world as I see it has a whole set of codes and values human society would view as not only morally reprehensible but in most counts down right illegal.
I wouldn’t say Eric has ever fought for the greater good, that’s not what has come across for me when reading. More like he has fought alongside others with a common purpose. That being that their lives on the whole would be better if the people they were fighting with/for came out on top.
I would say he has been fair to his subordinates and by that I don’t mean fair by our standards. I mean that it is laid out for them what is expected from them in the beginning. They may be sent on risky spying missions etc to gain information which would make Erics position, the area as a whole and as a by product their positions stronger but they wouldn’t be put in a life threatening situation on a whim if you get my drift.
Sookie herself has made some morally questionable choices. Re Debbie she could have turned herself in and served a jail sentance for self defence like Kennedy did when she shot her abusive boyfriend. She wouldn’t have had to involve anyone else. What she did do was continue to cover her own ass under the guise of also protecting Eric. Uhm no he would be quite capeable of protecting himself there. Then she has Amelia and Octavia mess with Tanyas head. Something she would baulk at if it were done to her. She has also started paralleling Eric with her actions. Eric chose Terry (the weakest in this situation) to spy on Sookie but promised him his PTSD dreams would stop, which they did. In Sookies plan to get rid of Victor she chooses Bubba who is also the weakest and both react the same way when it hit the fan…badly. Towards the end of the book she is aware she has changed and belives she needs to either fully commit to one world and its ways or the other or it would have all been for nothing.
As for kids, I don’t see it tbh. She has said before she couldn’t imagne a scenario where her children wouldn’t be targets, plus when dealing with Hunter it totally exhausts her. This leads me to believe she doesn’t think she has the patience she believes is required to raise children, so is another reason to not have them.
As far as her choices go for who to share her life with. They aren’t exactly fantastic:
Sam constantly manipulates her (getting her to house CT among other incidents) and she’s had him on a pedestal for so long (as one of the few people who have given her a chance) she can’t see it. Although his red/gold halo of hair in this installment has slipped to being strawberry blond and a mess. So maybe there’s some hope she’ll see through him.
Alcide so far as it benefits the pack he’s in. The turning up in bed in his underwear was not a good move and he was crest fallen to find out Sookie doesn’t like who he has become. He also manipulated her. The funeral, the pack master ceremony and the pack shaman incidents.
Bill wouldn’t know straight talking if it jumped out of a cake wearing nothing but a thong and a couple of sequins. He is naturally devious and convoluted. His passive agressive way of dumping Judith was just the latest example of how he operates. He also dumped Selah the same way and left it to Eric and Pam to tell Sookie when he hot footed it over to Lorena.
The only thing really going for Eric is that he’s up front about who he is and doesn’t pretend to be anything else. If he’s going to use someone, they know about it. If someones going to die, they know it. I mean how can anyone have ever had any doubts about what Eric was capeable of? The first time Sookie accidentally reads his mind he’s thinkng about threatening to kill or torture Bill to ensure her compliance, then counters that thought with not wanting to kill anyone he didn’t have to. Even in DTTW he admits he shows Sookie human niceties in the form of concern for those she cares about because he wants to be in her good favour, not because he genuinely feels the sentiment.In DR there is the line about the most terrible and wonderful thing about him loving her was that he only cared about her wellbeing noone elses. Then there is the scene before Micky shows up and he tells Sookie he can’t decide whether to screw her or kill her to get her out of his head. Not the actions of a pacifist. The violence against Pam therefore should not have been unexpected.
Am I condoning it? No.
In this series what Sookie seems to value is not the lack of propensity for violence but loyalty and honesty. She accepts they are all including her at times violent and manipulative. You can see why a normal human being should run from all of them (including her tbh) for the hills.
The essential spark has been described as a human having the open mindedness to accept the existance of the supernatural community and its values.
Other may say it as a willingness to let yourself be corrupted.
i like this post wahoozit..
Excatly, in DAAD Eric did tell Sookie ” should i kill you or fuck you”? in CD he threaten to torture Sookie, but he said he wont because he wants to fuck her & it would mess up her skin.. so this violence with Pam shouldnt be unexpected..
in fact alot of Eric Lover’s were defending these old statements made by Eric as playfullness..
I agree wahoozit. I also think the the breaking of the BB between S/E has given her a different perspective towards Eric. When Eric was “onboard” she had his presence as a frame of reference. She no longer has that. She must now take him at his word or at his actions.
CH’s explanation of the essential spark, seems to be pointing us to the fact that Sookie is more Supe that she or we ever thought.
Hey guys, I started a new thread for you. http://www.ancientpythoness.com/2011/05/05/dead-reckoning-pt-2/
I can’t tell you how sorry I am to not be a part of the conversation, but when it rains, it pours. In addition to my regular job, I’m putting on 3 programs for over a thousand people, interviewing job candidates, trying to get my daughter through graduation, into college, and off to China for the summer, and throw together a surprise party for her. I’m also involved in my cousin’s wedding and trying to get my guest room ready to accommodate the overflow from the house party. I’m the lucky one who gets to put up my aunt’s crazy roommate from college who thinks her son is the messiah. Oh…and all of this shite is going to go down in the span of 9 days at the end of May and beginning of June.
The little free time I”ve had this week has been spent reading DR. I just got to the meeting with Colton. Pam’s situation is killing me.